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Rusty Dropped
Joined: 19 Jun 2007 Posts: 142 Location: Koudekerk ad rijn Netherlands
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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 2:43 pm Post subject: wankel/rotary engine |
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Hi,
has anyone ever tried to fit a wankel engine (like NSU RO 80, Mazda RX7 / 8 oops, almost forgot GS birotor) in an A-type?
I've been thinking about the possibilities, and in my opinion an engine like this has a lot of advantages!
- small build engine
- high power output (old mazda RX7 1983, 1200 cm2, 85 KW)
- high revs (ideal for A-type / G-type gearboxes)
- i think most (or all) are 2 disk wankelengines (2 cilinder!?!)
- modern (or modernised) engines are really reliable
link: to see how it works : http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wankelmotor
english text: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wankel_engine
so thinking of these things, it is probably easier to fit an engine like this in an A-type than, for example, a BMW boxer or Motoguzzi engine!
i'd like to read your idea's, comments, etc.
greetzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Rusty
edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asPWO6j5ohU
to get an idea of the size of the actual engine : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFLPUphqdX4&feature=related |
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Etienne Hoodrider
Joined: 25 May 2007 Posts: 2829
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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 4:17 pm Post subject: Re: wankel/rotary engine |
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That's wild!
In the street where there is my garage, there is a guy with one of these new Mazda with wankel engine. The car is "tuning" with modified exhaust. It makes a fucking nice sound... _________________ www.super2cv.com |
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Lionel Dropped
Joined: 11 Jul 2007 Posts: 258 Location: NANTERRE-PARIS suburb-FRANCE
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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 4:59 pm Post subject: Re: wankel/rotary engine |
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Rusty wrote: | has anyone ever tried to fit a wankel engine (like NSU RO 80, Mazda RX7 / 8 oops, almost forgot GS birotor) in an A-type? |
Well Rusty, ... Citroen tried with M35:
This one was test bed for monorotor, and I agree that would be cool, but I see as much work putting a mazda wankel or BMW boxer under an A type bonnet, only maybe more space! _________________ 0 to 70 in the same day! |
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Kustombart Tiki burner
Joined: 25 Jun 2007 Posts: 901 Location: Arnhem, Netherlands
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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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NSU and Citroen birotors are nice but very high-maintenance. The seals (they have the function like piston rings in a regular engine) tend to wear out before 30.000 kms, resulting in oil-burning.
If you want to build one, go for a recent Mazda engine, they fixed that problem in the 80s. Find one that still has parts available.
The only reasons I could think of to not use a Wankel is that most people and mechanics are unfamiliar with the workings and that fuel consumption is high and that it performs best at high RPMs. Other than that: go for it! _________________ Don't ask me what I think of you 'cause I might not give the answer that you want me to.
www.kustombart.com |
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Rusty Dropped
Joined: 19 Jun 2007 Posts: 142 Location: Koudekerk ad rijn Netherlands
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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 5:17 pm Post subject: |
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Hi,
space is one of the main problems when putting in an other engine! (BMW boxer : very large carter, Citroen G-series 4 cilinder: to long, Motoguzzi: v-twin is never going to fit! and i can go on with this list for a while)
so a wankel engine would be great! the engine from an NSU RO 80 1000 ccm, 115 Hp! and another advantage is that the engines are very light (compared to other engines with same poweroutput)
oh no, I'm dreaming again, and I haven't even finished my other projects......
greetzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Rusty
one more thing, reliability can be improved a lot for the NSU RO 80 engine, when overhauled with modern materials! |
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Spookeend Dropped
Joined: 13 Sep 2007 Posts: 190 Location: Canabis Country
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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 5:39 pm Post subject: |
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I think it's really cool, been driving a RX 7 from my neighbour once, awsome kick above 4000rpm.
But, one of the advantages i disagree.
Ideal for a-type gearboxes? Even with a slight bit of tuning by mounting a visa engine or big-bore kit, the gearbox gets really worn out. I think it has not so much to do with the high revs, but with the increase of torgue.
More people have these problems. My 1st gearbox, died very soon after i put in the tuned engine. The next gearbox (Dyane 6 gearbox with low milage) is allready making weird noises.
Other then that, i would think a perfomance engine like that, would be way more fun when it would drive the rearwheels (as in the vw beetle).
Ow, and what type of gearbox was used in the m35 proto?? Do not know that.
Greatnix Spookeend
(ps : you are right, finish the other projects first, hahahaha) _________________ If it ain't fast, make it LOUD!!! |
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backfire Dropped
Joined: 14 Nov 2007 Posts: 346 Location: NL, 's-Hertogenbosch
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Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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although the engine appears small in size, everything needed to keep it running is a lot, open a bonnet from mazda and you will see itīs totally cramped with stuff to keep it running in good order.
The only plus of a wankel is that it keeps on revving, it loves to do that. Like said before high fuelconsumption and cilinders once damaged will set you back 1000 euro for repairs. _________________ 2CV, with Visa turbo charged |
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Olli Soviet-Finn Photoshoper
Joined: 25 May 2007 Posts: 2146 Location: Soviet-Finland
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stefan Dropped
Joined: 25 Aug 2007 Posts: 257 Location: holland
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Kustombart Tiki burner
Joined: 25 Jun 2007 Posts: 901 Location: Arnhem, Netherlands
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Posted: Sat May 17, 2008 11:36 am Post subject: |
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It sounds like an airplane for ten minutes. Then it sounds like a 5.000 euro overhaul.
If I think practical here for a second (end the dreaming) then Mazda is the way to go. The NSU brand name does sound better but I bet a Mazda engine will be easier to find and cheaper, too. I wouldn't be surprised if you can get parts for it at any Mazda dealer or even the parts shop around the corner. _________________ Don't ask me what I think of you 'cause I might not give the answer that you want me to.
www.kustombart.com |
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backfire Dropped
Joined: 14 Nov 2007 Posts: 346 Location: NL, 's-Hertogenbosch
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Posted: Sat May 17, 2008 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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For 1200 dollars you have a complete turbocharged rotary mazda engine. That's about 800 euro. _________________ 2CV, with Visa turbo charged |
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Rusty Dropped
Joined: 19 Jun 2007 Posts: 142 Location: Koudekerk ad rijn Netherlands
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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Hi
@ spookeend: with suitable for A-type gearboxes I meant high revs, i know that it won't last long, but you will have a lot of fun (and scary moments!
@ olli & steffan: I've seen the movies on Youtube as well, but i think about 100-150 hp will be enough for an A-type of lets say 600 kg's! and don't forget that mazda also uses 3 disk wankelengines (RX8) and I've seen 4 disk versions as well (don't know if those are factoryengines)
@ backfire: I think a lot of 'the stuff' around the engine can be located elswhere and a tuned A-type/ G-type engine (lust ook wel een slokje! :) ) (needs a bit more petrol as well, at the moment 1:10 visa engine in 2cv)
but except from the M35, a conversion like this has never been done??????
greetzzzzzzzzzz
Rusty |
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backfire Dropped
Joined: 14 Nov 2007 Posts: 346 Location: NL, 's-Hertogenbosch
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Posted: Mon May 19, 2008 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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No conversion that I have heard of, but jet conversion has also not yet been done _________________ 2CV, with Visa turbo charged |
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