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Olli Soviet-Finn Photoshoper
Joined: 25 May 2007 Posts: 2146 Location: Soviet-Finland
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Posted: Thu Jun 21, 2007 11:36 am Post subject: Using Visa (652) bellhousing on GS gearbox |
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I get guestion of Visa's bellhousing, so here you go.
Left is from GS and right one from Visa. Difference 3,5cm. You also get starter on better place..
Or you can use 2 starters! (then just need 2 rotors on flywheel)
GS and Visa's gearboxes are made in same box frame so they fit straight.
Notice that you need to cut holes for brake discs. (I dont know where they lost brakes in Visa )
Axle need to change too, other vice you have some seriour problems
Remember that whit this equipment you can also install GS 4/5-speed box
also on Visa 652 or 2cv (tuned) engines. More speeds and huge brakes
Only difficult part on this operation is cutting disc brake holes, but even
that was not really difficult.
Keep on tuning!
-Olli _________________ www.ollierkkila.com |
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Etienne Hoodrider
Joined: 25 May 2007 Posts: 2829
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Posted: Thu Jun 21, 2007 12:33 pm Post subject: |
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Do you mean the GSA 5 speed gearbox with Visa belhousing si same length than regular 4 speed 2cv gearbox?
That's quite interresting! _________________ www.super2cv.com |
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Olli Soviet-Finn Photoshoper
Joined: 25 May 2007 Posts: 2146 Location: Soviet-Finland
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Posted: Thu Jun 21, 2007 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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Etienne wrote: | Do you mean the GSA 5 speed gearbox with Visa belhousing si same length than regular 4 speed 2cv gearbox?
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Its not same lenght. I think its longer but I think it may fit under bonnet.
Also rear fixacation of gear box is different between 2cv and GS.
My friend was driving whit tuned Visa engine and GS gearbox in Dyane.
-Olli _________________ www.ollierkkila.com |
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JoZeF Grave Digger
Joined: 25 May 2007 Posts: 1734
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2007 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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Hi
I have compared a GS 5 speed and an AMI Super 4 speed.
The bellhousing is much shorter on the AMI 4 speed than on the GS 5 speed.
Like Olli said, you can (and must) fit AMI bellhousing onto GS Gearbox.
Other than that, the 5 speed GS and 4 speed AMI Gearboxes are the same length.
The problem is the rear end or the Gearbox : the AMI Super is curved in, where the GS is flat, (to host the 5th speed) that's why it hits the steering rods...
bye _________________ "That bumper fits there like sunglasses on pig" O.E.
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Etienne Hoodrider
Joined: 25 May 2007 Posts: 2829
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2007 2:33 pm Post subject: |
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Ok, I learned something!
Is the ami super belhousing same of all the visa belhousing? Just the one for the flat twin I presume. _________________ www.super2cv.com |
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Jasu Dropped
Joined: 30 Sep 2007 Posts: 211 Location: Finland
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Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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Olli wrote: | My friend was driving whit tuned Visa engine and GS gearbox in Dyane. |
Yes, guilty. And there is some pictures form my engine..:
Unfortunately I have not more pictures of that, these is taken when taking pictures was quite expensive... Ten years ago...
And don't care about cutted Dyane, it was so rusty that I cutted it to small pieces. But I must to see how will Dyane look like "real cabriolet"..! And under this rusty body, there was brilliant Ami Super chassis what is going to my 4wd project. (Some pictures here and here ) _________________ Make it today, tomorrow it's probably illegal... |
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later Snailer
Joined: 17 Oct 2007 Posts: 12 Location: Croatia
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Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:10 am Post subject: |
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Have anyone experience or comments about 652 & Ami gearbox? |
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Jasu Dropped
Joined: 30 Sep 2007 Posts: 211 Location: Finland
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Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 5:37 pm Post subject: |
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In Finland they usually use Ami8 gearbox, because of longer gears. Still they who have this gearbox with Visa says that gears are too short. When there is more torque in lower revs, it "needs" longer gear ratio-and it's much comfortable because there is less noise...
But I recommend that put Ami8 final drive (3.875) to 2cv6 gearbox, if you don't like GS(A) gearbox... _________________ Make it today, tomorrow it's probably illegal... |
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phoskam Snailer
Joined: 30 Oct 2007 Posts: 19 Location: Rossum, Netherlands
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Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 12:06 am Post subject: |
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I'm working on the same combination, gsa 1130 gearbox with tuned visa engine.
One thing I want to know is if you can use the gsa brakes in combination with a 2cv master brakecilinder
any idea's ? |
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backfire Dropped
Joined: 14 Nov 2007 Posts: 346 Location: NL, 's-Hertogenbosch
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Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:54 am Post subject: |
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why not P, both are LHM systems, maybe you will have to use a splitter for the brake lines. But you can use default splitter same as the one used for the rear brakes. _________________ 2CV, with Visa turbo charged |
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Olli Soviet-Finn Photoshoper
Joined: 25 May 2007 Posts: 2146 Location: Soviet-Finland
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Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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I'm using GS brakes on front and 2cv brakes on back whit LHM master
cylinder. Works fine!
-Olli _________________ www.ollierkkila.com |
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ami8i Snailer
Joined: 29 Oct 2007 Posts: 80 Location: Austria (Graz)
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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 3:02 pm Post subject: |
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Hello,
this summer I converted my Ami8i Break to LN gearbox + Visa652 bell housing + GSA break system.
I was surprised that space is rather limited in Ami8. I had troubles to find enough place to the speedometer line(?), because LN output shaft is not the same than in GS gearboxes. I couldn't remove the nut so I was not able to take a GS gear box cover + speedometer unit (with correct speedometer ratio).
I tried to save each mm so I shortened the Visa bellhousing (too much). You can't remove more than 1mm without getting troubles with clutch (springs, lever what ever - bad grinding noises).
Unfortuinality I lost nearly all my pics so I can't show you how I picked up some small levers for the cross box which is fixed as it was with the Ami8/Dyane gearbox.
My dream would be to modify a short GSA 5 speed box to use gear 1 to 4 from LN/Visa and the 5th should be an overdrive but much shorter than the GSA 5th. The best idea - but far out of my budget is the way as 'Perfect Products (Andre? 2cv.be? or 2cvpk.be or so) says in his catalogue. A new king wheel changes the diff ratio. :)
Since I built in the GS/LN/LNA/GSA 4 speed box I have no idea how to find space with a GSA 5 speed box. I don't want to lift the box above steering rods because lubrication would fail. Check cross section pics of Visa Club, GS/GSA, Axel. The main axe of engine/gearbox is not horizontal, the gear box is lower than the engine!!!
The LN (602ccm Dyane engine) bell housing looks beautiful oldfashioned and the housing would needn't be grinded to get space for the GS/GSA discs. But it has no sensor holes so I used a Visa6552/LNA62 bell housing.
I have a set of brand new Axel/Olcit inner vented brakes: discs, callipers, pads. Maybe I take them just for fun one day.
Since my driving style is cruising I don't need them 'really'. The (longer) studs are missing and the piston has DOT seals curerently.
The new shematic is funny. It's not so nice to get in/out in a small gab at parking lot because 1st and R are opposite (I guess as in R4) but now it's really easy to shift from 2nd to 1st in one 'layer'/direction! But reverse shifting from 3red to second is not so fine than previous (different 'layer')
»Horst _________________ »Ami8i Break http://megasquirt-de.serviceline.ch/success/index0001.htm
» BX14E.CO.2 Cruiser Break |
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Olli Soviet-Finn Photoshoper
Joined: 25 May 2007 Posts: 2146 Location: Soviet-Finland
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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:19 pm Post subject: |
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One guy in finland shorten his 5 speed gear box. I think he could take
around 2,5cm away from rear block where 5th gear is located. He
machined new rear cover and narrowed 5th gears rotors.
-Olli _________________ www.ollierkkila.com |
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ami8i Snailer
Joined: 29 Oct 2007 Posts: 80 Location: Austria (Graz)
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Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:39 pm Post subject: |
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Hello Olli,
thanks, forgot to mention that the extended 5th gear 'housing' could be modified. The nut (and main shaft) can be shortened a little bit. I guess a welding point is enough to protect ist from lo(o)sing.
But the lubrication 'nose' is needed to deliver the hollow main shaft with oil.
My 5speed box has no rear cover (lost) so I have to do my own by simple 0.7-1.0mm sheet of mild steel.
I heard of 'some' died 5 speed boxes which were lifted above steering rods because lubrication was not enough --> maybe an outside oil pump (EFI fuel pump?) could feed the seperated 'chamber' with extra oil.
Quote: | and narrowed 5th gears rotors. |
Does this mean he made the 5th speed tooth wheels smaller?
If yes, the width of common 2CV6/Dyane/Ami tooth wheels could be a number how much we need. I guess the GSA gear box was made for 70hp but not for 'poor' 35-45hp of some tuned flat twins.
Maybe something can be done with the gear lever too?
»Horst _________________ »Ami8i Break http://megasquirt-de.serviceline.ch/success/index0001.htm
» BX14E.CO.2 Cruiser Break |
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Joolz Snailer
Joined: 07 Apr 2008 Posts: 33 Location: Pays de Galles/Charente
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Posted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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Hi, Not sure if to put this here or start a new thread...
I am trying to organise a bigger gearbox to go in my 2cv, I have a LNA box and an AXEL box that is not complete. I want to use the LNA box because it is shortest but I find that the clutch splines are the same as the A-type box and not the same as the boxes for four cylinder engines.
I don't want to use the A-type clutch because it is only 160mm diameter the AXEL clutch is 180mm. I don't want to waste time making the A-type clutch work, if it is not strong enough.
Does anybody know if any citroens used a bigger clutch which fits the smaller input shaft?
Or does anybody know how strong the LNA clutch is?
I think if I need to shorten the bellhousing it will be ok if I also take the same amount off the front of the flywheel where it meets the crank? |
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